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Posted by Charlie
In Reply to: Easy for you to take mens choices away Charlie...
posted by #####
:#####
:tell 'em there all gonna make it and not to worry....:yikes!!!!
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Charlie:
"Ahem! Lord, I thank you that I'm not as other men. I used my spiritual eyes and ears even when I knew nothing about you and was without strength and dead in tresspasses and sins. I have reason to boast because I sought for and found my lost Good Shepherd before it was eternally too late. However, most of the human race, incluing many of my fellow workers, family, and friends will never perform as well as I did. Most of the pagan world will be lost because they didn't follow the inner light of their conscience as I so faithfully did. For narrow is the way that leads to life and only a few--ever will--find it. Finally I must confess with deepest joy and sincerity that it was the threat of your annhilation that caused me to hunger for you, dear Lord. Had I not had special revelation of that--even before I ever heard it taught--I would never have thirsted for or desired you.": #####:
:First of all Charlie you and I and everyone else were saved the same
:way...we heard HIS WORD and believed...why I cannot tell...
:it is a mystery to me and I can only thank the grace of God...Charlie:
WHAT?? Why should you thank God for what *you* succeeded in doing on your own?That is exactly why others can hear and not hear I also cannot tell...
: #####:
: God knocks at all doors...why He is not welcomed in I do not know...I have to presume that some amount of choice is involved by the individuals and that satan also has some influence at this door also...so whatever...that is the way it is and you and I are helpless to change what God has wrought...that doesn't make God the bad guy...His word is broadly published and available...we are presented with choices everyday...what makes one man help someone and another turn his head...? I say that is why we are here...there is no place in the book that says this offer to believe Him will be extended into another realm or another time...may it be so...I simply do not see it stated in the book for if it did we would all postpone indefinitely I am sure...Charlie:
#####, if this is the truth "as it is in Jesus" and we are to give thanks in and *for* "all things"--then this is a most appropriate prayer of thanksgiving.
How often do you offer it? :-): #####:
: I trust and believe that God will do what is right without presuming what He has planned or telling anyone they don't have to contemplate their eternal destiny because anyone with half a brain needs to think about their eternal destinies...heaven may not have gotten your attention without hell either Charlie...It at least may have made me look...but I knew about hell for along time without being a believer...It was when I saw the love of God that I believed...so you are right in that respect...Gods love draws men to Him...without a doubt...Charlie:
I'm not saying that there is no judgment or consequences. I'm only saying that the dogma of Holy Love's hopeless abandonment is not in the Bible. Sodom, Eygpt, Elam, Moab, Israel and others had "forever" judgments pronounced on them, and then were promised restoration. These things were written for our examples, upon whom the purposes of the ages have come. (I Cor.10:11) God changes not and is no respector of persons. Therefore Jesus *will* fulfill the law and the prophets: "What you would have men do to you, you do also to them." (Matt.7:11-12) But the doctrine you're hyping says He won't. Oops! Beware, bro... Didn't a sneaky snake once wheedle, "Hath God said??": #####:
: Charlie, perhaps God does know what He is doing...perhaps there are some who simply do not want to be joined in Him...and want to be alone...that is what hell is...to be alone...maybe they want to be alone and God gives them what they want...a place apart from Him...It is clear in the text that this position exists...perhaps in this God is MORE "just" and "loving" than with the "get in free sometime" card you are handing out...Only God knows the answers to such things Charlie, and only He can read the heart of men...we cannot presume upon His plan, whatever that may be...we can trust for ourselves and each will stand before Him alone...one on ONE...I believe what He says...HE is good and right and perfect and holy and attributes the same to those He loves in Christ...He may give those who do not desire this EXACTLY what they desire ALSO...: How many people have you heard say they WANT to be in hell with all their friends? You and I will both say they will go to a place apart...how long a stay is the only difference we have...maybe THEY have a choice too Charlie...maybe satan had a choice too Charlie...If there were no choice maybe God would be dancing alone also Charlie...perhaps there is "value" to Him in this...
: 1 Peter 2:
: 3 now that you have tasted that the Lord is good.
: 4 As you come to him, the living Stone--rejected by men but chosen by God and precious to him--
: 5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
: 6 For in Scripture it says: "See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."
: 7 Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe, "The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone,"
: 8 and, "A stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall." They stumble because they disobey the message--which is also what they were destined for.
: 9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.
: 10Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.: I believe what God has said Charlie, and this is my song...I believe...
: whatever He says is RIGHT...
: even if the apple does look good I would rather just believe Him...
: Sincerely loved in Him,
:#####
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Charlie:
Lots of words here, #####.But no issues fairly and squarely addressed.
You totally ignored those Old Testament examples of God's "forever" judgments and promised restorations, which I expected that you would. For they totally disintergrate the dogma that God plans to get rid of anyone. They just simply leave you no leg to stand on, dear brother, since Christ came to fulfill and not destroy the prophets who foretold these things.
Let's be honest, bro. If *you* believed on your own (which I did not) then *you* simply performed better than most of the human race, and therefore the credit goes to you. So you *can* logically pray the prayer, "God I thank you that I'm not as other men." And that is because (according to your doctrine) it is simply true, #####.
*You* chose Christ. It is just that simple. So that leaves you room to boast.
Since it is true (according to your "gospel") that you authored your own faith why would you hesitate to pray, "I thank you that I'm not as other men."? Are we not to give thanks for all things--especially for the truths of the gospel? The "truth as it is in Jesus"?
Nope. Not me, magee.
But whatever turns you on...
The gospel is not about "a chance" to "go to heaven" and (supposedly) avoid God's (Love's) hopeless abandonment. The gospel is not about the shallow and unscriptural phrase "Where will you spend eternity?" It is not about God foreordaining to have a creation forever divided between winners and losers--and most of them annhilated losers. Not so. The glad tidings of great joy which shall be to all people is Holy Love becoming all in all, totally reversing the curse of Adam's fall.
(I Cor.15:20-22)Yours rejoicing in His committed love,
Charlie
P.S. As I've told you before, #####, aside from the many, many Scriptures you trivialize or ignore, there simply is NO BASIS for "resting in God's grace" in your gospel. Not if you take your own sinfulness seriously. And not if you care about your loved ones who have gone before you as well as others God has place in your life. Not if you are honestly trying to be an "emulater" of your Heavenly Father. For if God never plans to fulfill His own law to treat others as he will be treated, then I have NO desire to be conformed to his "holy" likeness--and thus, to become worse than I already am.
Your gospel makes contemplating being conformed to God's holy likeness--horrifying. Think about it... And while you're thinking--remember how Moses preferred to be destroyed with Israel instead of preserved apart from them. Do you think the Lord would be pleased if today's church, yourself included, had the same kind of heart as Moses?
Charlie