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Posted by Charlie
In Reply to: really? Your leading must be quite infallible
then Charlie! posted by #####
#####:
: Because to the calvie and most unies, Jesus goes out as a
: shepherd to find only certain lost ones, then saves them.
: How do you *know* that the person you are saying "Jesus wants
: to save you *now*" is one of those relatively few people Jesus
: has irresistably determined to save in this eon?
Charlie:
I don't meant that--i--know. I mean that God knows, you turkey!
And those are the ones that he leads you to touch too.#####:
: The arminian - bless his heart hahaha - knows that Jesus has come to
: save *all* that are lost *now*, and that Jesus has poured out his Spirit
: on *all* flesh for that very purpose, to convict *all* men of the truth
: and to draw *all* men to himself. In Spirit, He is *infallibly* able to
: seek and find *all*. The question simply remains whether people will
: resist the very real spirit-gravity pull of the Son of God. If people do
: not resist, they shall surely hear the voice of the Son of God, and those : that hear shall surely live. But if men continue to love darkness rather
: than light (oh yes, the light *does* shine in the darkness),God is not
: going to force them to his love. It is a creature's dignity, lovingly
: imparted by the Father, to freely choose God's light or reject it.Charlie:
What? God has poured out His Spirit on all flesh--NOW? Wow...I'm speechless. THIS...is THAT which was spoken by the prophet, Joel? Holocaust after holocaust, dark ages, inquisition, world wars, Hiroshima...Give me a break, bro! As for God not "forcing" people to love Him...What you have yet to appreciate (but you will:-) is that He must FIRST free our wills that are dead in trespasses and sins and taken captive to do the devil's will. Otherwise they CANNOT be free.Therefore God's purpose will stand and He will do all of his good pleaure. If he will not, then he is not trustworthy, bro. And why? We then must--keep--trusting in OUR "free wills" to keep "believing" and "trusting" as is evidenced by "works" (without which, faith is dead) in
order to not die in unbelief and thus forfeit the "gift" of our heavenly "reward."Also, as I have pointed out, and don't mind repeating repeatedly... Because Arminianism ignores and opposes the Scriptural factor or the restoration of all things, it sabatoges the greatest commandment. For it requires us to love God UNconditionally while He "loves" (?) us
conditionally, as follows--"You shall love the Lord with the total and unconditional
comitment of your entire being--*while remembering* "the
truth as it is in Jesus" (?)--that His commitment to you
depends on your performance in this lifetime."Nope. Won't fly. Been there and--tried--that for decades.
But Mark, if you think you're capable of loving the Lord more (with stronger commitment) than he does you, all I can say is--"go for it." I inwardly abhored Him (though I desperatly tried to keep my abhorance
"back filed") when I bought into Arminianism's half/gospel. For many years I honestly thought that God required that I love Him wholeheartedly while also believing that He might get rid
of me--and/or my living and deceased unsaved loved ones!
And that toxic lie of religious performance cause me to
inwardly detest and distrust him.However I now know that there is ABUNDANCE of Scripture that states otherwise, and these great and precious promises render it possible to at least--begin--fulfilling the greatest commandment. So now? I serve Him ONLY because I love Him. Add fear of His hopeless abandonment (or His "allowing" my hopeless abandonment of Him) into the mix--oops! THAT pure love-motivation disappears. (For it only takes a little leaven to leaven the whole loaf.) And I can assure you that you'll have a gospel that will never reach people who are on THE bottom.
Not unless you do it dishonestly by hyping the positives and then filtering in the negatives later as you "disciple" those whom you've
enticed in with the sugar-coated message. (And I'm sad to say that used to be my policy.)The only way to buy into Arminiaism is to already have some self-confidence going, to have a well-developed habit of compartmentalized thinking (mental backfiling mechanism)
Also one has to be excited about being a "kind of ONLYfruits" of our Lord's worldwide (?) harvest of souls whose "high calling" is to "go to heaven" to the exclusion of all the latterfruits of His harvest. (While the
Scripture actually teaches that the church is "the beginning" [Gk=paschal firstfruits, if I recall]--so that--in ALL CREATION He will have the supremacy.)But some are quite content that the "called out" church should be an
"Us-Four-and-No-More-Going-to-Heaven" club--instead of being Christs
"co-heirs/co-laborers/co-regents" that with Him will inherit the heathen--even all things. Or... perhaps one would need to have a secret "death wish", in the case of the annhilationism version of Arminianism? To such ones the thought of "extinction" sounds like "blessed relief" I would surmise...Yes, the Firstfruits Seed of Abraham HAS fallen into the ground and died. (Note the firstfruits teaching of Christ and Paul in Jn.12:23-32, Rom.11:10-16, 1 Cor. 15:22) And so He WILL draw *all* men to
himself. For He lived and died and rose again SO THAT He might be Lord of both THE dead and THE living. But each in his own order. Jesus didn't say He would "try" to draw all men to Himself. He shows us by His firstfruits teaching in Jn 12 that He WILL draw all men to Himself. Oops! There's a "hint" you've overlooked about hope in the ages to come for those who reject Him in this life, by the way. And there are several others, #####, if you'll look for them.We can jaw more, but this post is already way too long!
I plum got on my soapbox, didn't I?Charlie